…“clean”? Well shit, I have some work to do then!:-P

anyone can send them a message about it.

Not if the modlog merely says “mod”. Note that the ability to hide the username of the mod is not universally utilized - it is a community setting that can be turned on or off as the mod sees fit. When on though, someone would have to DM every single mod in the entire list in order to get an explanation for a ban that was surprising to them. So yes definitely a highly anticipated feature to offer a modmail.

Of course participation in any Fediverse communications is all optional. That said, many people complain in r/RedditAlternatives that Lemmy is too authoritarian for their liking, so addressing their concerns may help enhance the Threadiverse by welcoming a wider variety of people. Which is now being done by PieFed more than Lemmy. I am not trying (anymore) to convince you to make an account on a PieFed instance, just relating that fact as part of the wider conversation about matters happening in relation to the Fediverse, because I think it is good to know about and an interesting subject!:-)

Oh it’s definitely not on the same level, agreed. Just authoritarian and to be avoided by those not wanting to be constrained by having to exist inside such an echo chamber.

Edit: I want to add another point about the first post (https://lemmy.world/post/18414833). Even if it was merely someone throwing a fit, the response by the admin to ban people who merely downvoted one of their posts still seems inconsistent with democratic principles and rather 100% aligned with fascist authoritarian ones where Seahorse does whatever Seahorse wants to in that moment, rules and standards of conduct be damned. He can do as he pleases of course… and we can avoid that instance too if that is how he wants to run it.

I definitely recall multiple posts about that instance (and Seahorse in particular) in !yepowertrippinbastards@lemmy.dbzer0.com. One example is the downvoting one (https://lemmy.world/post/18414833), another even more authoritarian example is https://lemmy.cafe/post/10511187 where Seahorse banned the person who reported a comment calling for violence, stating “someone please kill [this person]” - mind you, he did not ban the person making that comment, but the person who REPORTED it. Making reports is apparently a bannable offense, mind you with no text in the sidebar stating that, and subsequent apologies to the admin going un-responded to (according to that post).

Midwest.social - the admin Seahorse famously banning people for downvoting them. Yeah definitely less well-known than the usual 3.

the most human place on the internet.

Yes… “human”, that’s right these are the most human humans that ever humaned their way to humanness, r-r-right!?

(Except for the bots ofc)

Originally I meant that the Lemmy ecosystem is generally speaking more authoritarian than the PieFed one. This is in large part due to the preferences of the devs.

I will now also add the new related point that I think the coding design of Lemmy lends itself more to authoritarian control. It seems geared and marketed more towards instance admins, then mods, then users only last. Tbf PieFed is the same way here, but with a different focus due to the preferences of the main designer.

Lemmy is even more authoritarian than Reddit itself in many ways: Reddit at least sends a user a notification whenever their content is removed, plus users (and anyone who commented or otherwise has a direct link) can still see their content even after that. Reddit users may also contact the moderators via mod mail. In contrast, despite how Lemmy has the modlog, again there are no notifications for removal, and the modlog just says that the action was done by a “mod” (it used to always have the username, but now it can just say “mod”, so over time Lemmy has actually moved in the direction to become MORE authoritarian than it used to be, not less).

To be fair, PieFed also lacks a mod mail or notification upon removal of content, but I feel like for Piefed it is simply because it is new and new features being added monthly, even practically weekly. Whereas for Lemmy it gives an impression at least that it is a design choice that seems unlikely to ever change towards more democratic principles. We will see how they each develop over more time I suppose.

For now, many Lemmy instances are very free and open, subject to the software constraints, while others are extremely closed down, most especially lemmy.ml that the main Lemmy developer seems to spend an inordinate amount of time moderating rather than tweaking the codebase. That’s fine btw, it’s his code and he can do whatever he wants with it, although for me I choose PieFed instead, for all the above reasons and so much more.

Speaking of, none of what you said sounds to me like it should result in someone receiving a visual icon due to poor reputation. I’ve had some massively downvoted content myself, but if the system is implemented properly then it will consider more like a median downvoting rather than maximum or even average. Theoretically someone who only made 10 comments and >=9 of those were downvoted heavily, yeah they would get that icon. However, the icon does not cause filtering of their content (there are other things that can but those are entirely separate and not based on the user account), it’s merely a visual display. I’ve upvoted, downvoted, and replied to people’s comments even when I can see that icon - so it in no way blocks me from doing so or from seeing it in the first place. But it does (helpfully imho) label it, so that I have a better indicator going in what I am getting myself into.

I doubt that a normal user would get themselves flagged with the low rep icon though. Even receiving twice as many, triple as many, quadruple or quintuple as many downvotes as upvotes would not do it. To receive ten times as many downvotes as upvotes is someone who is entirely ignoring the consent of users to have to read their crap ahem “offered opinions”. That is Reddit-level hostility there, and something that your average conscientious Threadiverse participant will never experience - except unfortunately on the receiving end, as some very few people seem to take great pleasure in absolutely flaunting the rules in every community that they visit.

It would also take a MASSIVE vote-altering campaign to counteract that effect. Something which if only due to its sheer scale might be noticed. And at that point it would be easier to create a new Lemmy account - some instances require nothing to make that happen - or even spin up a new instance in order to skirt the effects of downvoting.

In short, reputation is a part of the normal human set of interactions. PieFed acknowledges that and exceedingly gently places an icon next to the usernames of the most egregious offenders. I for one do not think that is a bad thing, even on purely theoretical grounds. We aren’t trying to recreate a new 4chan here (we already have Hexbear for that - seriously! 😐)

Skavau already covered the point about lemmy.ml being authoritative whereas Lemmy.today is not (in general there are 4 well-known tankie authoritarian instances and Lemmy.today is not one of those:-).

I found this here https://join.piefed.social/features/ :

Note how that link points to PieFed.social. Yes, those are defederated at the instance level, so a user cannot work around that - Lemmy defederation works the same way. However, PieFed.zip is a separate instance from PieFed.socual, and does not defederate from much at all.

Low Reputation Indicator

I find that feature very helpful. It’s merely a visual indicator placed next to the username, which is very different than the software making decisions for me on what content to show or not, and that indicator helps clue me in that responding to e.g. an argumentative person is unlikely to enhance my day. Also while I don’t recall the details on how it is set, imagine if you will that someone receives 10x more downvotes total than upvotes. Such an account is usually a troll. Most people get downvotes occasionally, but that would not trigger the indicator to be shown (and again, even if it somehow did, it’s just a visual icon, not a block or anything).

Lemmy is FAR more known for authoritative censorship than PieFed. Particularly those instances mentioned like hexbear and the infamous lemmy.ml where you cannot criticize Russia, China, or North Korea without being banned from every community on the entire instance including those you’ve never even heard of.

Might be a Rihanna fan.

I also don’t see Taylor Swift’s jet… wearing jeans.

Oh, nvm.

It’s like NSFW or even more relevant NSFL (also spoiles) - perfectly fine for some recipients but not for all, so best to LABEL IT. Labeling is compassion.

Then again, people who post AI slop against the wishes of the recipient communities tend not to be the most conscientious?

A relevant rule #1, above even the one about NSFW and another one about spam:

AI Art: While we appreciate AI generated art, there are more appropriate communities to post that type of art to. Please keep posts to non-AI generated art only. This rule includes AI art that was then manually manipulated (e.g. drawing on top of something generated by AI).

That reads pretty clear to me?

Only $9.95 _{for the first hour, then $39.99 thereafter.}

The Tom Hanks one was really good.

Using ChatGPT to “fix” Wikipedia, what could possibly go wrong? (/s as the approach seems valid, this is just a funny statement)

Uh… (should someone tell them? In the USA they’ve been up since before Halloween 🎃)

Speak for yourself about the future, for me it is already here in the present! 🤩

it will probably end up being the direct trigger of suicides by people unfairly labeled as bots

Yeah, possibly? Then again, the same could be said for running out of milk at the local grocery store, and more generally not everyone you dislike is (literally like) Hitler. By framing your argument in these terms you are distracting from the goal that you seem to be trying to reach. Take my answer however you will but I meant it in kindness.

And it just keeps getting better, every month!!:-)

People can block an entire community, preferring others instead where the mods keep out those kinds of posts. Nothing is perfect but this is a new tool that has potential to help people get what they want. e.g., is there anything wrong with NSFL posts, or bots, so long as they are properly labeled as such? If this tool helps organize at least some of the mess, then it can be helpful some of the time?

Ofc, only in PieFed communities, and for people with PieFed accounts. Though if Lemmy likes the idea then perhaps it can add it as well (same for Mbin, nodeBB, flarum, pixelfed, Mastodon, Loops, etc.).