Why do people on Lemmy dislike LTT?

Yeah that’s a pain. I’ve also had Android kill Lemmy in the background while I went to my browser to check a spelling of a word… A draft feature would help too

When you say it becomes a need does this mean that not merging them would course the projects to fail?

Fail in what sense? It would definitely make consumer-minded people unsatisfied and most likely drive them away to another project/fork. For tech enthusiasts it would only do good (considering the contributions are enshitifying).

This means that if the option to merge the contribution didn’t exist in the first place (like non free software) the project would fail.

I’m probably missing what you’re trying to say, but since contributions come from companies, they would definitely be merged if the project was owned by the company making contributions.

Actual freedom is taking away peoples rights to make things worse. If you want an example of what happens when actual freedom is available look at the free market.

Strange to hear that while discussing free software but anyways freedom is not a static notion. Compared to feudal economy, free market is free, but it’s not free judging by our modern needs. And in fact it’s the exact thing I’m trying to go away from. Free, open and decentralised production I was talking about is its successor that breaks through the alienation and brings creative freedom to every individual.

Are you aware that software maintainers don’t have to merge the contributions these people are pushing?

Yes, I literally said that in the first line of the comment you’re replying to.

Are you saying that copyleft software is enshitififying because big companies are pushing too many (optional) contributions?

Yes. I’m not saying that always happens, but I do believe many projects enshitified a good amount because a lot of their contributors have become big companies. Or sometimes companies make an entirely new project that is enshitified from the very beginning but still gets included in other FOSS projects. Both merging a contribution or including a project are optional, but since FOSS projects get involved in this whole producer-customer relations model, where everything is done centrally by the developer and served ready-to-use to passive consumers, merging those contributions kinda becomes an actual need of users. So yeah, if you dig deeper, it’s ultimately the very involvement in this commercial centralised production model and not just companies, that causes enshitification, but I still think that letting companies just fuck off and do their own centralised thing separately from decentralised DIY-like development which, to my mind, is actual freedom, might help.

Bro calm down, I’m not trying to insult you. I’m sorry what I said made you so upset.

I’m not blaming the GPL of anything, I’m not saying license defines software design, I’m not proposing a solution and the whole point of my post was about the contradictory nature of the problem. You just seem to have missed my whole reasoning. Now, I don’t know why looking at the negative sides of the trade-off the GPL is making bugs you so much, but if it’s really not your thing, you should stop wasting your time on this self-contradictory mess and just be happy with GPL. Especially because I’m too small for my “corporate apologia” to be effective.

Okay maintainers don’t have to, but they usually end up doing so as those contributions are still valuable. The key point is that even though free software is called “free”, a huge chunk of it is going through the same process of “enshitification” as proprietary software, because of being developped by companies and being a part of this corporate, non-free world. So separating that from FOSS by letting companies keep their work by themselves seems to help a little bit.

There’s no direct relation, yes, but centralisation and bloating are both things commercial software development tends to because of the nature of developper-consumer relations. And GPL forces companies to contribute their code which is often based on those principles back to the original project. So I think there is indirect relation.

Oh wow, didn’t know that! Thanks

Well, for me personally the way the software is developped and designed is not something abstract. Centralisation and bloating, for example, makes understanding and developping software a significant amount more difficult which puts you in a more passive role and so making you much less free

I get your point, but what I’m talking about is actually moving away from corps in a way even more than GPL by keeping their contributions away from FOSS projects (as corps usually have no interest in open sourcing them)

The more I read replies under my post, the more I understand how little I know lol Pay for a license to monetize open source code? Which one of GPL and MIT allows that?

Interesting! I think having any code licensed under GPL could cause a cascading effect of having to open source even more code, whereas with MIT you can just stop making it open at any point

Gpl doesn’t prevent monetisation/commercialisation

Sorry, I used a wrong word there. I meant closing the source code and turning the project into a product, aiming commercial profits instead of fulfilling users’ needs.

You can also dual license

Hmm, didn’t think of it… But doesn’t it defeat the GPL’s purpose of preventing closing the source code?

There are lots of MIT projects that are carried by companies.

Okay, my experience with MIT is probably too limited, never heard of projects like that. But why do those companies publish their source code? Aren’t they loosing profits?

Anyway, my point was about projects that are started by enthusiasts and then, as they grow popular, receive a lot of contributions from companies, which (as I initially thought at least) would otherwise make them close sourced and so keep FOSS projects “clean”. But yeah if companies have a reason to keep their contributions open source even they don’t have to, I’m confused

Gotta love Finnish philosophy!

Italy! I like that they have kept their culture and their mentality which is so rich, diverse, profound and just overall positive. Italians are also so open and friendly!

Why are you using the thorn? Gotta admit though, it looks pretty dope and convenient

For all companies and corpos to switch to Linux, it needs to become a new Windows, because the core difference between proprietary and free software, in my opinion, is not the way it is distributed but the way it is developped and used. It is “we’ll do everything for you in a centralised manner and you’ll just passively consume it” vs. “everyone is a creator, creating new stuff on their own in a decentralised manner out of the will for self-actualisation” philosophy. So I think truely free software isn’t compatible with centralised and uncreative type of production which most companies are. Basically DIY vs. commercial support.

For me everything after childhood seems to be the best part of life, because after you grow up you finally can make your life the way you want and if you have enough strength you can make it absolutely wonderful.

Childhood can be cool too but only if you happen to be born to a good family.

Good linux mobile OSs already exist, but phones’ hardware is still proprietary and messed up, so it is very difficult to provide a good hardware support for those mobile OSs

Ohh good to know